Someone should do a map like this of Park Slope. I’ve seen listings as far south as 46th st, as far west as Nevins and as far Northeast as Nostrand and Dean
**
you give Williamsburg too much credit….it’s not even as big as the gray area you describe….it pretty much stops at Union ave
zoe
Just a little thing — the street you have marked as Franklin in Greenpoint is actually West.
KS
They do the same in Fort Greene/Clinton Hill. I’ve seen many apartments squarely in Bed-Stuy advertised as “Fort Greene.” I guess they figure new transplants won’t know the difference and be duped?
dorothy
Right you are, zoe. Thanks.
I had originally broken Williamsburg down into Northside, Southside, South Williamsburg, Residential East Williamsburg and the East Williamsburg Industrial District, but the detail was a bit much for this small map. For those who are interested: Northside is bordered by North 15th, BQE becoming Union, Grand street and the East River. Southside is between Grand, Union, Broadway and the East River. South Williamsburg is between Broadway, Flushing and the East River. Residential East Williamsburg is bordered on the north side by the BQE, skirts Vandervoort, Cooper Park and finally Bushwick on the east, and then hits Flushing to Broadway to Union. Industrial Williamsburg is bordered by the BQE, Queens, Flushing and East Williamsburg. And I was priced out of Williamsburg in 2001.
dorothy
Mike – I think this trend is trended. But the prehistory is right here:
I’m from Australia and planning a 2 month holiday in New York at the end of this year. I want to rent a place in Williamsburg. A real estate agent has sent me the details of a place on North 7th Street/Bedford Avenue and another at South 8 Street/Marcy Avenue.
I want to be close to public transport and close to shops, galleries etc – basically ‘in it’. Are these places in good locations? Don’t fully trust real estate agents.
Don’t trust real estate types, especially in Williamsburg. Both of your locations seem to be in nice areas, although I don’t think that South 8th hits Marcy.
Bedford and N 7th = huge amount of young hipsters, influx of nyu students on weekend nights. Directly on top of busiest subway station around.
South 8th – The area JUST south of the Williamsburg bridge is full of older-hipster types. Multiple wine bars, condos, above-ground train and highway noise. Further south is nearly 100% Hasidic.
I just mean actually plotting the series over time as a trend, not that it’s “trendy”. :)
Joe Zee
Dorothy, Please! Enough of this “East Williamsburg” nonsense! The neighborhood doesn’t exist anymore; and, when it did, it was located in Queens, NOT Brooklyn. This was an area bordered by Ridgewood to the south, Maspeth to the north, Bushwick to the west, and Middle Village to the east. Oh, it was spelled with an “H”. Here’s a map of the area:
Being a born and bred Greenpointer, I take offense at the repeated attempts by realtors and other know-nothings who continually push the border of Williamsburg into Greenpoint proper. McCarren Park was originally called Greenpoint Park, prior to 1909. Why? Because it’s located in Greenpoint, NOT Williamsburg, that’s why. Greenpoint ends at the southern end of McCarren Park, North 12th Street, and runs along Meeker Avenue. Anything north of Meeker Avenue is Greenpoint.
B
Hi Dorothy,
I wish you’d address the opposite problem, which irks me. I live off the Morgan L in the East Williamsburg Industrial Park, but half of the kids moving here seem to be convinced this is Bushwick or a made-up area called “Morgantown” … this seems to be the result of rumors that “East Williamsburg” was made up by realtors (not just applied further east than it should be). Seems also to be an idea that “Williamsburg” really only means played-out yuppie Bedford Ave partytown (“Northside”) when it is a much broader and more diverse area. PS I would love to see a separate map of the sub-neighborhoods of Williamsburg ALA your Greenpoint one…
So glad to know I now live in Williamsburg. How do I explain to my neighbors, in Spanish, that they need to start being more ironical?
FWIW, East Williamsburg is actually the name of the industrial park that extends as far east as Flushing, and that gets serviced by the Morgan and Montrose stops on the L. It’s a mix of working factories and warehouses, and ones turned into overpriced artist’s lofts. Realtors liked the name and started using it for every crappy neighborhood between Williamsburg and the city limits.
Francis
I’m surprised by this map, and imagine that it might be a recent phenomenon. When I lived just off Wycoff a couple of years ago, on the East edge of the map, if the landlord had claimed that the property was even remotely related to Williamsburg, there would have been a claim of false advertising. And I would never have looked at the Craigslist ad in the first place, because I am not a millionaire.
Ianf
Above locality/community-borders arguments provide enough material for you to draw an additional map with overlapping boundaries of where the “real” Williamsburg consensually ends and where it begins. I bet it would differ considerably from Craiglisters’ claims….
dorothy
A great plan, Ian, but I don’t have the clout to get the dozens of interpretations really needed for an interesting map. And it would be a great map.
I used to live by DeKalb and Throop, and that is NOT a nice area.
I know it’s a ten minute bike ride away from the nice part of Williamsburg, and I know the subway is nearby, but it’s still very bad.
Like, you will be woken up by gunshots at night bad.
Steve
I totally agree with dequeued. Criminally inaccurate to say the least. Talk about misrepresentation. It ain’t East Williamsburg. It’s Bushwick. It aint North Williamsburg. It’s Greenpoint (strange since I thought Greenpoint was actually somewhat popular). I can’t count how many times I’ve seen such posting lies. Sadly, MOST of the listings are like this.
The resolution is simple: require them to post the address.
I agree that this should be a regular feature! I know I’d love to see Park Slope, Prospect Heights, and Fort Greene/Clinton Hill charted.
red flags
So nice of everyone not to say how fucking RACIST this shit is. I know, I know. We’re not supposed to call the ironic, white, self-involved, gentrifying dipshits “racists” because they are so… ironic. And since they are too unconcerned with anything but themselves to have an opinion on anything — how could it possibly be fucking RACISM.
Well, white douchebags — everyone of you suburban losers is displacing black people, puerto ricans and all the “unhip” people who do things like work for a living (or try).
“Williamsburg” just means “white.” So where the whites go, ipso facto it becomes “Williamsburg”. Because you are fucking RACISTS.
dorothy
I will be sure to tell the Polish people in Greenpoint that.
This definitely needs to be a regular post/feature. Trending data!!
Anytime I see anything on Craiglist that’s obviously in Bushwick or Bed-Stuy marked “East Williamsburg” I flag it for deletion on principle.
Note that ‘back in the day’ (1845) anything east of Bushwick Ave was part of Bushwick, and the southern border of Williamsburg was Broadway. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c1/1845_Williamsburg_Map.jpg
Someone should do a map like this of Park Slope. I’ve seen listings as far south as 46th st, as far west as Nevins and as far Northeast as Nostrand and Dean
you give Williamsburg too much credit….it’s not even as big as the gray area you describe….it pretty much stops at Union ave
Just a little thing — the street you have marked as Franklin in Greenpoint is actually West.
They do the same in Fort Greene/Clinton Hill. I’ve seen many apartments squarely in Bed-Stuy advertised as “Fort Greene.” I guess they figure new transplants won’t know the difference and be duped?
Right you are, zoe. Thanks.
I had originally broken Williamsburg down into Northside, Southside, South Williamsburg, Residential East Williamsburg and the East Williamsburg Industrial District, but the detail was a bit much for this small map. For those who are interested: Northside is bordered by North 15th, BQE becoming Union, Grand street and the East River. Southside is between Grand, Union, Broadway and the East River. South Williamsburg is between Broadway, Flushing and the East River. Residential East Williamsburg is bordered on the north side by the BQE, skirts Vandervoort, Cooper Park and finally Bushwick on the east, and then hits Flushing to Broadway to Union. Industrial Williamsburg is bordered by the BQE, Queens, Flushing and East Williamsburg. And I was priced out of Williamsburg in 2001.
Mike – I think this trend is trended. But the prehistory is right here:
The Migration of Hipsters Along the L Line: An Independent Study, 9/2001-8/2002
Hi,
I’m from Australia and planning a 2 month holiday in New York at the end of this year. I want to rent a place in Williamsburg. A real estate agent has sent me the details of a place on North 7th Street/Bedford Avenue and another at South 8 Street/Marcy Avenue.
I want to be close to public transport and close to shops, galleries etc – basically ‘in it’. Are these places in good locations? Don’t fully trust real estate agents.
Thanks.
Trudy –
Don’t trust real estate types, especially in Williamsburg. Both of your locations seem to be in nice areas, although I don’t think that South 8th hits Marcy.
Bedford and N 7th = huge amount of young hipsters, influx of nyu students on weekend nights. Directly on top of busiest subway station around.
South 8th – The area JUST south of the Williamsburg bridge is full of older-hipster types. Multiple wine bars, condos, above-ground train and highway noise. Further south is nearly 100% Hasidic.
Try:
http://williamsboard.com/ for hipster arguments and sublets.
Hey Charles,
Thanks VERY much for your advice. Great to get real opinions from locals. I’ll also give Williams Board a go.
Thanks :)
I just mean actually plotting the series over time as a trend, not that it’s “trendy”. :)
Dorothy, Please! Enough of this “East Williamsburg” nonsense! The neighborhood doesn’t exist anymore; and, when it did, it was located in Queens, NOT Brooklyn. This was an area bordered by Ridgewood to the south, Maspeth to the north, Bushwick to the west, and Middle Village to the east. Oh, it was spelled with an “H”. Here’s a map of the area:
http://www.bklyn-genealogy-info.com/Map/Newtown.html
Being a born and bred Greenpointer, I take offense at the repeated attempts by realtors and other know-nothings who continually push the border of Williamsburg into Greenpoint proper. McCarren Park was originally called Greenpoint Park, prior to 1909. Why? Because it’s located in Greenpoint, NOT Williamsburg, that’s why. Greenpoint ends at the southern end of McCarren Park, North 12th Street, and runs along Meeker Avenue. Anything north of Meeker Avenue is Greenpoint.
Hi Dorothy,
I wish you’d address the opposite problem, which irks me. I live off the Morgan L in the East Williamsburg Industrial Park, but half of the kids moving here seem to be convinced this is Bushwick or a made-up area called “Morgantown” … this seems to be the result of rumors that “East Williamsburg” was made up by realtors (not just applied further east than it should be). Seems also to be an idea that “Williamsburg” really only means played-out yuppie Bedford Ave partytown (“Northside”) when it is a much broader and more diverse area. PS I would love to see a separate map of the sub-neighborhoods of Williamsburg ALA your Greenpoint one…
w/r/t Dorothy’s first comment:
Skirts Vandervoort was my favorite Vandervoort!
So glad to know I now live in Williamsburg. How do I explain to my neighbors, in Spanish, that they need to start being more ironical?
FWIW, East Williamsburg is actually the name of the industrial park that extends as far east as Flushing, and that gets serviced by the Morgan and Montrose stops on the L. It’s a mix of working factories and warehouses, and ones turned into overpriced artist’s lofts. Realtors liked the name and started using it for every crappy neighborhood between Williamsburg and the city limits.
I’m surprised by this map, and imagine that it might be a recent phenomenon. When I lived just off Wycoff a couple of years ago, on the East edge of the map, if the landlord had claimed that the property was even remotely related to Williamsburg, there would have been a claim of false advertising. And I would never have looked at the Craigslist ad in the first place, because I am not a millionaire.
Above locality/community-borders arguments provide enough material for you to draw an additional map with overlapping boundaries of where the “real” Williamsburg consensually ends and where it begins. I bet it would differ considerably from Craiglisters’ claims….
A great plan, Ian, but I don’t have the clout to get the dozens of interpretations really needed for an interesting map. And it would be a great map.
These listings are criminally inaccurate!
Some of those blue dots are in BAD neighborhoods.
I used to live by DeKalb and Throop, and that is NOT a nice area.
I know it’s a ten minute bike ride away from the nice part of Williamsburg, and I know the subway is nearby, but it’s still very bad.
Like, you will be woken up by gunshots at night bad.
I totally agree with dequeued. Criminally inaccurate to say the least. Talk about misrepresentation. It ain’t East Williamsburg. It’s Bushwick. It aint North Williamsburg. It’s Greenpoint (strange since I thought Greenpoint was actually somewhat popular). I can’t count how many times I’ve seen such posting lies. Sadly, MOST of the listings are like this.
The resolution is simple: require them to post the address.
I agree that this should be a regular feature! I know I’d love to see Park Slope, Prospect Heights, and Fort Greene/Clinton Hill charted.
So nice of everyone not to say how fucking RACIST this shit is. I know, I know. We’re not supposed to call the ironic, white, self-involved, gentrifying dipshits “racists” because they are so… ironic. And since they are too unconcerned with anything but themselves to have an opinion on anything — how could it possibly be fucking RACISM.
Well, white douchebags — everyone of you suburban losers is displacing black people, puerto ricans and all the “unhip” people who do things like work for a living (or try).
“Williamsburg” just means “white.” So where the whites go, ipso facto it becomes “Williamsburg”. Because you are fucking RACISTS.
I will be sure to tell the Polish people in Greenpoint that.